They’re both shitty imperialist countries responsible for wars and genocide.

I’ll take neither, thanks.

Yeah, 100+ kids is fucking wild.

Telegram is owned by Russian Elon Musk and the FSB. Avoid it if you can.

Durov is an absolute scumbag though. Russian Elon Musk.

Telegram shouldnt even be in the conversation when there are alternatives like Signal.

I’d be thoroughly shocked if the FSB didn’t have a backdoor for telegram.

does not hold elections

How long has Putin been in power now?

anti-colonial force

Tankies gonna tank.

Hope you pass the purity test when they come for you.

Some interesting stuff here, it’ll take me a while to read through it all.

Nothing really seems to support the idea that NATO conducted a genocide though.

Your first link is a dubious site that sources itself to support it’s argument.

As for the language law. It could have been handled better but the impact was overblown by Russian propaganda.

Also you ask Russian imperialism to be viewed in the context of NATO provocation. Why is it not also fair then to view the language bill as a response to blatant Russian aggression?

When do you think Ukraine invaded Iraq? You mean the Soviet union controlled my Moscow?

There needs to be evidence of NATO aggression against Russia for me to actually try to defend it (which I wouldn’t anyway)

So you believe western volunteers are mercenaries?

What would you call Russian prison battalions, kidnapped indian students and north Korean regulars?

Do you know how tiny 100km² is in comparison to the entire of Ukraine?

The reality of the war is a sparsely guarded Frontline across hundred of kms of empty land that frequently changes hands.

Ukraine also still holds land in Kursk according to current osint.

enabling you to marry your buttfucker

So you’re just blatantly homophobic?

Let’s assume you’re correct about US interference in Maidan.

Why do you believe that is an excuse for war, but Russian interference in the Ukrainian state (to the point that their president was a Russian puppet), was acceptable?

You don’t have any problem with Russia removing Ukraine’s right to self determination?

Why does Russia’s defense rely on the oppression of other states?

At the end of the day, millions of people are dead or injured because of Russian bullets. Do their lives mean so little to you?

Fair.

I also only read the article after your first comment to be completely honest.

Russia first invaded Ukraine in 2014 ran a proxy war in the interim and has failed to complete it’s military objectives after nearly four years of total war?

Russia has over a million casualties.

Is this what winning looks like?

Unclear when IMF interference demands for austerity were known.

I think you’re conflating two separate issues. The IMF was not involved in trade talks between the EU and Ukraine. It was when Ukraine was seeking loans but Yanukovych didn’t reject to ratify the EU bill because of the IMF.

CIA/US state propaganda operations to fabricate that opinion, was done purely for nazification and warmongering purposes

To what end goal?

Is it so hard to believe that given the choice between closer ties to the EU or a gay hating, poverty stricken state run by robber barons and oligarchs, Ukrainians might have preferred the EU?

The idiocy of the public makes them resort to their programing.

This isn’t a fair argument, I could say the same thing about you, and you could say the same about me. How can we find truth when we both believe the other is simply regurgitating programming from some shadowy propaganda source.

I’ll ask this: Do you feel yourself entrenched in these views or are you actually open to changing them through discussion?

immediately massacred opposition in Odessa,

This didn’t happen though.

removed Russian language rights

This also didn’t happen.

Again no one is saying otherwise.

I’m very confused now. Because it seems like we actually agree with each other then and I’m not sure why we’re fighting.

I think NATO sucks, but I also think Russia does. The only thing I care about in this situation is Ukrainian autonomy.

If you believe Ukraine has a right to self defense and self determination then we’re in agreement.

Let’s look at this from another perspective.

Russia has completely failed it’s “special military operation” in Ukraine and is bogged down in a war of attrition with a nation that is not in NATO.

NATO countries are supplying a trickle of arms to Ukraine, but without a single NATO boot on the ground, without a single aircraft carrier, Russia has been stopped in its tracks and has failed to complete the majority of it’s military objectives, having even lost actual Russian territory to Ukrainian counter offensives.

Clearly Russia would not stand a chance if NATO decided to invade them.

So that begs the question, if you believe NATO wants to invade Russia, and it’s clear Russia couldn’t stop them, why haven’t they?

I engaged with it. It’s saying the Serbs were responding to a proxy war initiated by the CIA when they were literally just exterminating Bosnians.

You can give me your summary but I’m not reading any more dubious links on the matter, especially when link bashing is being used as a rhetoric device to prevent your argument being challenged.

And again:

1. NATO did not attack Russia
2. Russia invaded Ukraine

Do Ukrainians have a right to defend themselves from Russian imperialism?